| Stran v tématu: < [1 2 3 4 5] > | Why can't I get work? Autor vlákna: Steve Melling
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Heinrich Pesch 
Finsko
Local time: 10:28
Člen (2003)
finština -> němčina
+ ...
| Heinrich-Pesch-Haus | Jan 9, 2010 |
Yelena Pestereva wrote:
My goodness! Something must be done with it! I also found that the web was full with my posts in the Russian forum including all off-topics I had started for mere fun.
[Edited at 2010-01-09 05:04 GMT]
I happen to have some predecessors of the same name, which are still honoured a lot. If someone makes a search with Google and finds out that I'm an imminent economist or even a cardinal of the catholic church I do not mind much. Never have seen any Proz-posting coming up when searching for my name.
Cheers
Heinrich
| | | | Sebastian Witte
Německo
Local time: 09:28
Člen (2004)
angličtina -> němčina
+ ...
| Whereas a handful of agencies will reply to your well-written, thoroughly devised application if | Jan 9, 2010 |
you email several hundred of them presenting a highly promising (or should I say competitive?) applicant's profile -- which does not necessarily mean they will commission you frequently later on* -- I'm not so sure if the same will apply in the case of direct clients - even if you opt for more impressive, rather expensive paper-based applications. This could be because of direct clients preferring to give work to agencies, the reasons being that agencies can handle multiple pairs based on just o... See more you email several hundred of them presenting a highly promising (or should I say competitive?) applicant's profile -- which does not necessarily mean they will commission you frequently later on* -- I'm not so sure if the same will apply in the case of direct clients - even if you opt for more impressive, rather expensive paper-based applications. This could be because of direct clients preferring to give work to agencies, the reasons being that agencies can handle multiple pairs based on just one inquiry, saving the end customer considerable outsourcing efforts. Also, agencies can make dreams of quick turnaround times come true if using various freelancers for a given project and subsequently taking care of aligning their terminology for consistency.
On top of that, agencies can be successfully sued in case something goes wrong whereas most freelancers usually do not have much to pay damages out of. Unless they have liability insurance which not many do.
* = NB: The response ratio among agencies lacking a publicly accessible payment record might be higher and so could be the number of inquiries coming in from these kinds of translation agencies. This could be due to these generally having a hard time finding suited linguists willing to work for them. I haven't been able to test this as I do not apply to these "based on an internal business policy" (meaning I simply never do it as a general rule).
[Edited at 2010-01-09 15:49 GMT]
[Edited at 2010-01-09 15:53 GMT]
[Edited at 2010-01-09 16:25 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Realistic view | Jan 9, 2010 |
..
Since this thread had degenerated into a fist fight, perhaps you should post it under a new thread with a suitable title such as "Review my job applications, please" or suchlike.
FISTFIGHT? REALLY? WHERE?
Darn! I missed it. Must have been removed.
France is a country with a social security system. It's no shame to make use of it in difficult times. There are all kinds of government arrangements to help someone with a new business on their feet. Creating false hopes about quick income generation via ProZ Jobs is not going to pay the bills.
What's wrong with being realistic?
| | | | | I HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM | Jan 9, 2010 |
Hi, I have been a translator since 20 years, qualified, with a postgraduate diploma in legal and business translations and I am now not getting any jobs! I suspect I know the reason...
Just a quick question - is using CAT tools now really indispensable for a translator? It seems that the knowledge and experience are not enough now. Frankly speaking I am not so young and I was learning typing on a typewriter...inow of course I know all Microsoft Applications, Word, Excel, Power Point... See more Hi, I have been a translator since 20 years, qualified, with a postgraduate diploma in legal and business translations and I am now not getting any jobs! I suspect I know the reason...
Just a quick question - is using CAT tools now really indispensable for a translator? It seems that the knowledge and experience are not enough now. Frankly speaking I am not so young and I was learning typing on a typewriter...inow of course I know all Microsoft Applications, Word, Excel, Power Point and all that but I am not skillful in CAT. I don't have Trados because I cannot afford to buy it, I have Wordfast and did basic training, but it is very difficult for me to grasp...I am really desperate...pls share your experience and thoughts with me, Lidia, English-Polish translator, email: [email protected] ▲ Collapse
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Brian Young
Spojené státy americké
Local time: 00:28
dánština -> angličtina
| CAT tools are not indispensable | Jan 9, 2010 |
That is a fact. Perhaps some agencies demand their use. That does not mean that CAT tools are indispensable. Find other agencies or outsourcers. Personally, I would rather not translate at all if I was absolutely required to buy a monster like Trados. I prefer to use my time translating, not struggling with endless software issues, and definitely NOT participating in this business of "fuzzy matches", and returning expanded glossaries and translation memories. It seems to me that this is a form o... See more That is a fact. Perhaps some agencies demand their use. That does not mean that CAT tools are indispensable. Find other agencies or outsourcers. Personally, I would rather not translate at all if I was absolutely required to buy a monster like Trados. I prefer to use my time translating, not struggling with endless software issues, and definitely NOT participating in this business of "fuzzy matches", and returning expanded glossaries and translation memories. It seems to me that this is a form of mass self-exile of translators to a labor camp.
Another thing: it was mentioned above that competition is very fierce today. A lot of people are looking for work, and it seems that many of them, with a semester in a foreign language, and a vacation abroad, have joined in as "translators". Let's not enter into a race to the bottom: CAT tools, translation memories, $0.02 per word, accepting payment 60 days after a job is delivered, allowing outsourcers to do the word count, and make deductions as they see fit.
If you are good, then don't engage in this rat race. There is, and will be, a demand, and a need, for real translators, and quality work. It won't come from CAT tools or Google translate. ▲ Collapse
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Lidia Lewandowska-Nayar wrote:
I have Wordfast and did basic training, but it is very difficult for me to grasp...
Wordfast is a very simple program. It took me several hours to learn it though I am also, mildly speaking, not good at IT as I never studied it at school or university. I was also learning typing on a typewriter. Nobody can have problems with Wordfast. Trados is also a simple program, so just keep trying, and I am sure you will soon reach your goal. Both programs are extremely useful for a legal translator. You will be able to triple your output and salary.
| | | | B D Finch
Francie
Local time: 09:28
francouzština -> angličtina
+ ...
| Cat tools and profiles | Jan 9, 2010 |
When agencies use ProZ.com to look for translators, they want to find enough information in the profile to convince them quickly that it is worth contacting you. That means clear and comprehensive information succinctly expressed, use of a CAT tool (I know that some very good translators don't use them, but agencies like CAT tools), sample translations, a photo. Remember that the PM scanning your profile might have very limited skills and limited knowledge of your target language, so they will... See more When agencies use ProZ.com to look for translators, they want to find enough information in the profile to convince them quickly that it is worth contacting you. That means clear and comprehensive information succinctly expressed, use of a CAT tool (I know that some very good translators don't use them, but agencies like CAT tools), sample translations, a photo. Remember that the PM scanning your profile might have very limited skills and limited knowledge of your target language, so they will be wanting to tick boxes. On the other hand, if the PM is skilled and does have a good knowledge of your target language, you cannot afford a less than polished presentation or mediocre sample translations.
Do they take any notice of KudoZ points? I really don't know, but I imagine that they probably look at a few contributions to KudoZ, not necessarily just ones you got points for, to see the quality of your contributions.
I have occasionally referred potential private clients to my ProZ profile. There is the risk that, after I have led them to ProZ, they will then use it to find a cheaper translator so I am selective about when I do this. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Steve Melling
Francie
Local time: 09:28
francouzština -> angličtina
+ ...
AUTOR TÉMATU
Yelena, hi. Which type of Wordfast do you have - Pro or classic? Thanks, Steve
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Lidia Lewandowska-Nayar wrote:
Hi, I have been a translator since 20 years, qualified, with a postgraduate diploma in legal and business translations and I am now not getting any jobs! I suspect I know the reason...
Just a quick question - is using CAT tools now really indispensable for a translator? It seems that the knowledge and experience are not enough now. Frankly speaking I am not so young and I was learning typing on a typewriter...inow of course I know all Microsoft Applications, Word, Excel, Power Point and all that but I am not skillful in CAT. I don't have Trados because I cannot afford to buy it, I have Wordfast and did basic training, but it is very difficult for me to grasp...I am really desperate...pls share your experience and thoughts with me, Lidia, English-Polish translator, email: [email protected]
Depending on your specialization, CAT tools might be indispensable or not. They are absolutely indispensable in the localization industry, but not so much working with just in legal texts, for instance. About which to use, I also had a tough time getting used to Wordfast. Try Metatexis or MemoQ which are remarkably easier to use and Metatexis even has a free version.
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Steve Melling wrote:
Yelena, hi. Which type of Wordfast do you have - Pro or classic? Thanks, Steve
I didn't buy Wordfast. I used the demo-version when a client asked me to use Wordfast. But I have Trados-7. I consider CATs indispensable for a legal translator. There are many repetitions in contracts, articles of association and similar documents. I also translate financial statements which also have much in common. My clients often ask me to translate 100 pages of some report in 3-5 days. How would I do it without Trados? I must confess that it took me half a year to learn Trados -- not because it is difficult but because I am not good at computer sciences -- but now it is only Trados that helps me earn my bread. And I am sure now that half a year is too much. Several weeks are quite enough.
[Edited at 2010-01-09 17:11 GMT]
| | | | Anja C.
Švýcarsko
Local time: 09:28
němčina
| Get a day job to pay your bills. Be selective when it comes to choosing your potential clients. | Jan 9, 2010 |
Jeff Whittaker wrote:
On the other hand, companies looking for a "bargain" are usually the ones who quote rates. In other words, if a rate is stated, 9 times out of 10 it is way too low.
Brian Young wrote:
If you are good, then don't engage in this rat race. There is, and will be, a demand, and a need, for real translators, and quality work. It won't come from CAT tools or Google translate.
I couldn't agree more. That's why someone looking for budget solutions (rather than a quality translation) will post a job (rather than search the directory for the right candidate and contact him/her directly through his/her profile). Of course I'm generalizing here, but if I can give you a piece of advice from my own experience: Don't waste your time sending out quotes or unsolicited applications; get a day job to pay your bills and spend your spare hours carefully planning and marketing your translation business. Take your time. Be patient. And most of all: Be selective.
Edited:
Shame on me, I forgot the most important thing: Love your job – translating, not the day job (or even better, both of them)!
[Edited at 2010-01-09 19:53 GMT]
| | | | Heinrich Pesch
Finsko
Local time: 10:28
Člen (2003)
finština -> němčina
+ ...
| Re-invent yourself | Jan 9, 2010 |
Not getting jobs? Perhaps you are selling your services too cheap? Get a sought after speciality like medicine, law etc.
And invest in your software. If you have lots of work and don't use TEnTs (formerly called CAT-tools)? Good for you, but don't suppose TEnTs don't help finding jobs.
A dentist that does not invest in the most modern technology will soon be without patients.
Direct clients also often do translation management in-house. The have a specialist who can give... See more Not getting jobs? Perhaps you are selling your services too cheap? Get a sought after speciality like medicine, law etc.
And invest in your software. If you have lots of work and don't use TEnTs (formerly called CAT-tools)? Good for you, but don't suppose TEnTs don't help finding jobs.
A dentist that does not invest in the most modern technology will soon be without patients.
Direct clients also often do translation management in-house. The have a specialist who can give advise to the translators without delay. Using agencies is not always the most efficient way. But these are highly specialised customers. And they also start to use TEnTs in order to save money.
Regards
Heinrich ▲ Collapse
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| Reality Check | Jan 9, 2010 |
I DO appreciate all the good advice and I'm sure Steve does, too.
However, his question is: "Why can't I get work?" in conjunction with ProZ Jobs.
The current reality is that there are tens, maybe hundreds of millions of people without a job. They are not sitting still. They will find ways of making some money. Some of them will do this by offering freelance services, such as cheap translation via online sites such as these.
Here is a current example:
... See more I DO appreciate all the good advice and I'm sure Steve does, too.
However, his question is: "Why can't I get work?" in conjunction with ProZ Jobs.
The current reality is that there are tens, maybe hundreds of millions of people without a job. They are not sitting still. They will find ways of making some money. Some of them will do this by offering freelance services, such as cheap translation via online sites such as these.
Here is a current example:
This job is in what used to be an 'expensive' language pair. 0.10-0.12 euro per source word were the norm (sometimes more, depending on calculation system). WITHIN Germany these prices are still possible. ON THE GLOBALIZED SPOT MARKET, however, the price is much lower. Look:
Now you may say: "Ha, they can offer as low as they want. Nobody is going to respond, so what does that prove?" Well, ProZ has a Quote system in place, for the convenience of the outsourcer. This is what it shows about above job:
25 quotes for a crappy job. Too cheap, tough subject matter, nasty file format.
Without cynicism: the reality of the situation is that translation prices are gradually being 'globalized' and that ProZ and its imitators have added to that development. You now have to be HIGHLY specialized and you have to be able to do LOCAL networking, plus all the other things that were suggested in the former postings and then you will MAYBE stand a chance of making a good living in the current market situation. The rest is ******** [We don't normally accept abbreviations of bad language either. Do you think you could change "**" to something less offensive? - ProZ Moderator].
I don't mean anyone any harm when I'm suggesting to look for a steady job until this recession blows over. When is it over for us? When the unemployment numbers are down.
[Edited at 2010-01-09 20:33 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | ProZ jobs & CAT tools | Jan 9, 2010 |
I must agree that a good profile at ProZ and a small but gorgeous bouquet of flowers called "specializations" really help.
In 2009 I had also problems with quoting and winning a job posted in here (actually, I can't remember winning any job last year...), but on the other hand, I had a couple new agencies that had seen me in the translator directory, then had visited my profile deciding it would be worth to try to wor... See more I must agree that a good profile at ProZ and a small but gorgeous bouquet of flowers called "specializations" really help.
In 2009 I had also problems with quoting and winning a job posted in here (actually, I can't remember winning any job last year...), but on the other hand, I had a couple new agencies that had seen me in the translator directory, then had visited my profile deciding it would be worth to try to work with me.
If someone counts on job posts only - well... :rolleyes: For instance, in the EN>PL pair numerous jobs offered concern the USA or the UK residents and if ever there a slight chance of an interesting project, the agency/company proposes you then $ 0.02-0.04 per word ("but we can guarantee loads of work"!).
Regarding CAT tools... Until then end of the previous century I used to work in libraries and produce my translations with an old typewriter. Now, for a few years I have been one of the biggest fan of Wordfast Classic and have moved all my TMs into files compatible with WF. I have even had my own WF students! To my big surprise, I am currently falling in love with Across (which is a completely different system). Surely it needs some time to learn a new tool - that's why (instead of following some classes myself) I prefer to do it at home, at my own pace.
I always do my translations in CATs = although a big number of my clients want to receive my translation in a simple text file.
It helps me not only in case of website or game localisation, but also when I want and/or need to build up a decent glossary. Such tools can really save a lot of time.
Lidia, Steve and all Colleagues> I wish you a small dose of good luck and a big dose of good year!
PS. Steve> you have a big construction company in your city, maybe you could try to talk to them? ▲ Collapse
| | | | Giles Watson
Itálie
Local time: 09:28
italština -> angličtina
In memoriam | With Proz, what you see is not all of what you get | Jan 9, 2010 |
Marinus Vesseur wrote:
I DO appreciate all the good advice and I'm sure Steve does, too.
However, his question is: "Why can't I get work?" in conjunction with ProZ Jobs.
And the answer, quite simply, is that Steve does not have a sufficiently focused Proz profile. When Steve finds his way to the top of one of the language combination+sector specialisation directory search lists, he will get offers that focus on his availability and not on the outsourcer's rate expectations.
Without cynicism: the reality of the situation is that translation prices are gradually being 'globalized'
One would hope so, since communication is so much easier now than it was twenty or thirty years ago! For a translator with a properly focused market profile, this is a fantastic opportunity.
and that ProZ and its imitators have added to that development. You now have to be HIGHLY specialized and you have to be able to do LOCAL networking, plus all the other things that were suggested in the former postings and then you will MAYBE stand a chance of making a good living in the current market situation.
Fair enough, my expectations are probably low compared with yours but for the past three or four years, my income has been rising steadily in real terms.
The rest is BS.
I take it that by "BS" you mean "Bad Strategy" on the part of those translators who can't cut the mustard.
Anyway, Steve is just starting out and he's got plenty to think about from this thread!
The main thing is to know precisely what you can and can't do, package the former as attractively as possible and hold out for top dollar. You won't be able to do that if you just wait around for the bottom feeders to post your ideal job at some appallingly low rate.
Giles
[Edited at 2010-01-09 20:37 GMT]
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