| Stran v tématu: < [1 2] | UK Translator divulges confidential information Autor vlákna: Anette Herbert
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| Congratulations, Katherine! | Feb 25, 2004 |
Regardless of what anyone thinks of her actions (and we are all free to agree or disagree with her ), Ms Gun has been cleared of the charges against her at the Old Bailey today; this was the anticipated outcome in any case, as the case could only have generated negative press for the government. It could have also led to more official secrets being disclosed! A real can of worms...<... See more Regardless of what anyone thinks of her actions (and we are all free to agree or disagree with her), Ms Gun has been cleared of the charges against her at the Old Bailey today; this was the anticipated outcome in any case, as the case could only have generated negative press for the government. It could have also led to more official secrets being disclosed! A real can of worms...
You can read more about it at www.guardian.co.uk
[Edited at 2004-02-25 12:32] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Caro McL
Irsko
Local time: 01:01
němčina -> angličtina
+ ...
| Katherine cleared of charges today | Feb 25, 2004 |
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1155681,00.html
See full story at above link
GCHQ whistleblower cleared
Mark Oliver and agencies
Wednesday February 25, 2004
GCHQ whistleblower Katharine Gun demanded an explanation today after the case against her of disclosing information and breaking the Official ... See more http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1155681,00.html
See full story at above link
GCHQ whistleblower cleared
Mark Oliver and agencies
Wednesday February 25, 2004
GCHQ whistleblower Katharine Gun demanded an explanation today after the case against her of disclosing information and breaking the Official Secrets Act collapsed after the prosecution offered no evidence.... ▲ Collapse
| | | | Anne Lee 
Velká Británie
Local time: 01:01
Člen (2003)
nizozemština -> angličtina
+ ...
| Hot from the press | Feb 25, 2004 |
Just noticed on the BBC website that the woman in question has been cleared of any wrong-doing. A lack of evidence is quoted.
Quote:
There has been speculation the government was worried about the disclosure of secret documents during the trial, particularly the advice by Attorney General Lord Goldsmith about the legality of war. Unq... See more Just noticed on the BBC website that the woman in question has been cleared of any wrong-doing. A lack of evidence is quoted.
Quote:
There has been speculation the government was worried about the disclosure of secret documents during the trial, particularly the advice by Attorney General Lord Goldsmith about the legality of war. Unquote
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3485072.stm
Whoops - my message was sent at the same time as the previous one, apparently.
[Edited at 2004-02-25 14:47] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Monika Coulson
Local time: 18:01
Člen (2001)
angličtina -> albánština
+ ...
SITE LOCALIZER | Agree with Eno and James | Feb 25, 2004 |
We know that everything we do has its own consequence, whether it be good or bad (it depends on our action.)
Whatever she thought it was the right thing to do, will of course, get its own consequence, and there is no way out.
Eno puts it right in his comment, many of us might not be happy with every single law in our country, but we all obey them. Why? Because we know the consequence that will follow if we did not obey...
Have a happy day everyone.
Monika... See more We know that everything we do has its own consequence, whether it be good or bad (it depends on our action.)
Whatever she thought it was the right thing to do, will of course, get its own consequence, and there is no way out.
Eno puts it right in his comment, many of us might not be happy with every single law in our country, but we all obey them. Why? Because we know the consequence that will follow if we did not obey...
Have a happy day everyone.
Monika
p.s. Just read now about her being cleared of charges today, I guess she was a very lucky person
Eno Damo wrote:
Hi,
What we have here is the case of a person (translator) who decides to break the law, because it doesn't feel it is right according to his own beliefs. We all feel the same about this law or that law, whether it is tax law, human rights or criminal law. The bottom line is that all people dislike all laws, but all people have to live by all laws. If you believe that the job you are doing doesn't match what you believe or think is right, than you have a choice (and that the good thing about our societies): change your job or change your beliefs.
Cheers,
Eno
[Edited at 2004-02-25 18:46] ▲ Collapse
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James Calder
Velká Británie
Local time: 01:01
španělština -> angličtina
+ ...
| Yes, she was lucky Monika | Feb 25, 2004 |
It was not her job to question government policy and as a civil servant she is obliged to remain politically impartial, something she clearly was not. If we all went around expressing our political opinions as public servants then it wouldn't do much for the concept of public service, would it? I personally believe that the Official Secrets Act is a very necessary piece of legislation and that the fact that the charges were dropped has more to do with the government not wishing to reveal further... See more It was not her job to question government policy and as a civil servant she is obliged to remain politically impartial, something she clearly was not. If we all went around expressing our political opinions as public servants then it wouldn't do much for the concept of public service, would it? I personally believe that the Official Secrets Act is a very necessary piece of legislation and that the fact that the charges were dropped has more to do with the government not wishing to reveal further secrets in a court case (highly understandable in the current climate) than anything else. She would have been far better advised discussing the matter with her superiors before going to the press but, of course, that doesn't bring so much publicity with it. I for one will not be reading the exclusives or the inevitable book.
[Edited at 2004-02-25 16:10]
[Edited at 2004-02-25 16:11] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | After the case was dropped, she demanded an explanation | Feb 26, 2004 |
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1155681,00.html
From the Guardian: "Katharine Gun demanded an explanation today after the case against her of disclosing information and breaking the Official Secrets Act collapsed..."
Wow, Katharine's not backing off. That's moxie.
Confidentiality is also an extremely important part of our work as translators. If we decide to break that confidentiality for whatever reason we must be fully aware of the implications and prepared to accept the consequences.
Right, James. The laws are before us... and we are left to decide.
| | | | Anette Herbert
Local time: 01:01
angličtina -> švédština
+ ...
AUTOR TÉMATU
Thank you all for valuable contributions. I started the topic and I am sure will not finish it but I feel I need to add a thought. There are strong feelings of not breaking laws or confidentiality, change your beliefs or change your job as someone says.
Well, there is always the third option, change the laws...
Honestly, what would the world look like today if nobody challenged existing laws and nobody had broken them and were proud of it?? Look around in the world, people do... See more Thank you all for valuable contributions. I started the topic and I am sure will not finish it but I feel I need to add a thought. There are strong feelings of not breaking laws or confidentiality, change your beliefs or change your job as someone says.
Well, there is always the third option, change the laws...
Honestly, what would the world look like today if nobody challenged existing laws and nobody had broken them and were proud of it?? Look around in the world, people do it all the time.
Many professions bound to confidentiality have a disclosure clause where serious crime is concerned. I myself worked under that for the Citizen's Advice Bureau.
We are not priests someone said, and we are not robots or slaves to the rules our employers set up just to earn that dollar, either I say. Translators could agree to as a profession fight for that right of disclosure to prevent serious crimes without
ruining our careers or self respect. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Textklick
Local time: 01:01
němčina -> angličtina
+ ...
In memoriam | Precedent??? | Feb 26, 2004 |
"Translators could agree to as a profession fight for that right of disclosure to prevent serious crimes without
ruining our careers or self respect."
Nope.
I think translators should agree as a profession to maintain integrity and respect confidentiality.
We can (and should) exercise the right to turn down stuff that we don't like for whatever reason.
BUT: She didn't have that option in her particular job and was in (notional?) violatio... See more "Translators could agree to as a profession fight for that right of disclosure to prevent serious crimes without
ruining our careers or self respect."
Nope.
I think translators should agree as a profession to maintain integrity and respect confidentiality.
We can (and should) exercise the right to turn down stuff that we don't like for whatever reason.
BUT: She didn't have that option in her particular job and was in (notional?) violation of the Official Secrets Act which is a very serious matter. Are we translators or decision makers? She should have thought about that before signing up...
Much as I believe that her motivation was honourable, I think it was very foolhardy. She didn't save any lives, much as she probably wanted to. And what other aspects were involved in this can of worms? Did she know? Of course not.
Under "different political circumstances" i.e. if the Government did not have egg on its face about his whole crock of c**p, then this obvious "whitewash" would probably not have happened. She would be sitting there right now as a “guest of Her Majesty”.
Let’s get real: as a profession, we would get laughed out of existence were we to even attempt to demand “whistle-blowing rights”.
She was very lucky in getting off lightly; I just hope that in future other translators in her position will NOT see this as a precedent when they see something they don't like, whatever it may be. The price they pay could well be much, much higher indeed...
If you CHOOSE to work with the "The Family", then the word is "Omerta", whether you are a butcher, a baker or a candlestick maker.
[Edited at 2004-02-26 20:29] ▲ Collapse
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Sheila Hardie
Španělsko
Local time: 02:01
Člen
katalánština -> angličtina
+ ...
I am sure Katharine Gun was fully aware of the possible consequences of her actions.
As I see it, the question here is whether it is better to break a law or to betray one’s own conscience. I think it is clear what Katharine chose – and it must have been a very difficult choice.
At the end of the day, we all have to live with our own conscience. We are free to decide.
Sheila
[Edited at 2004-02-26 18:21]
| | | | Maria Belarra
Španělsko
Local time: 02:01
francouzština -> španělština
+ ...
| There are more responsibilities | Feb 26, 2004 |
James Calder wrote:
It was not her job to question government policy and as a civil servant she is obliged to remain politically impartial, something she clearly was not. If we all went around expressing our political opinions as public servants then it wouldn't do much for the concept of public service, would it?
[Edited at 2004-02-25 16:10]
[Edited at 2004-02-25 16:11]
Leaving aside the fact that I have nothing against people expressing their political opinions eveywhere, I think that what we are truly discussing is not if we would have done what Katherine Gun has done, but if confidenciality goes above preventing a crime. I suppose she leaked information because she sensed -or knew- that it was a crime.
If we were in a situation that forced us to choose between respecting the rules of our job and preventing or denouncing a crime (in this case, death-serious stuff), what would we choose? It is not a question of "change your beliefs". Usually people's beliefs are deeply rooted and they do not think about them in a frivolous way. We are more than translators, we have a responsibilty as citizens and as human beings, I would say.
(Keep the thread going, please..)
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