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SDL Trados 8 (2007) cannot reorganise TM, database corrupted, Workbench gets stuck while exporting.
Thread poster: Marinus Vesseur
David Turner
David Turner  Identity Verified
Local time: 16:58
French to English
+ ...
Rebuild from uncleaned files Aug 8, 2007

Marinus Vesseur wrote:
Thanks Martin, but it looks like this TM might be lost, at least the last 2 months of it that I have no backup of.


Maybe you can rebuild the lost part from your translated uncleaned files, if you still have them.
Sounds like a good point to switch to another CAT program...

Regards,
David


 
Marinus Vesseur
Marinus Vesseur  Identity Verified
Canada
Local time: 08:58
English to Dutch
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
SDL misrepresents data safety of Trados database Aug 12, 2007

David Turner wrote:
Sounds like a good point to switch to another CAT program...

Yes it is, except that I would like to be sure that the 'other CAT program' is more reliable when it comes to the integrity and repairability of my databases.

I hold Trados/SDL responsible for selling me a product that has not implemented basis safety provisions against data loss AND is irrepairable, at the same time fraudulently misrepresenting the product as completely safe ("Never translate the same sentence again").

Could anyone tell me from when on Trados TM's could not be edited in a simple editor anymore? Was it Trados 6 that had that change of file format?

By the way, this is the last segment in the exported TM after which Workbench gets stuck:

"
18022007, 08:50:26
WIN2000
27052007, 20:34:24
MARINUS
0
{\nosupersub m}{\super 2}
{\nosupersub m}{\super 2}
"

I suppose that it's the next segment, the one that does not show in the exported TM, that is the real culprit.

Thanks for your help thus far.

- Marinus

[Bearbeitet am 2007-08-12 04:41]


 
David Turner
David Turner  Identity Verified
Local time: 16:58
French to English
+ ...
Export as text first Aug 12, 2007

Marinus Vesseur wrote:
Could anyone tell me from when on Trados TM's could not be edited in a simple editor anymore? Was it Trados 6 that had that change of file format?


AFAIK, you've always had to export TWB TMs as a .txt file before you can edit them by a text editor. Your problem is you can't do that.
In general TWB TMs cannot be read directly from one version to another (presumably to force users to constantly update).
If you're looking for a transparent, open format, you'd be better with Wordfast whose TMs are just plain text files.

David


 
Jerzy Czopik
Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 16:58
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
Coming late, with perhaps not so much help... Aug 12, 2007

Marinus Vesseur wrote:

Dear all

I have sent a request for help about this issue to SDL support, but the answer is not satisfactory.

After importing a small txt TM that I made using WinAlign my largest and most important TM cannot be exported or reorganised anymore. Both processes stop at segment 2800.

The trouble is that Workbench OVERWRITES the backup TM while exporting, so I now may have lost BOTH my regular TM AND the backup txt. The only other backup I have is several months old.

SDL support tells me to try to remove the corrupt entry with the help of the Maintenance option in Workbench, but I see no possibility of finding a segment on the basis of its number.

Does anyone know how to access the entries and remove one entry manually on the basis of its number or otherwise?

Also SDL support asked me if I have any other backups.

This gets me somewhat upset. Was I not told that if I would start using Trados I would not have to translate the same sentence twice? Doesn't that imply that I can trust the program to be so designed as to avoid total data loss when one entry is corrupted? Can it not be expected that a 'professional' program, as Trados is boasted to be, would prevent this sort of thing from happening or at least would make it in some way 'repairable'?

Not a very different situation to what happens sometimes in other programs, ie like Word. Files might get corrupted and what you did was a breach of all safety rules - importing a TM from alignmet into your MAIN and thus most important TM without having kept a backup of this TM somwhere.
Leaving aside all your understandable irritation you must admit, that you did not protect your most important property against any computer failure at all. Would you have run backup on a daily basis, your loss would have been not that big, if even you would have suffered any. Please don't get me wrong, I'm not saying here SDL Trados is a perfect program, but what you demand from it cannot be guaranteed by any software in this world. This is why a daily backup is so necessary.
So what I'm writing here will certainly not hepl you at the moment, but after you have recovered somehow from this disaster you should think about backuping your data on a daily basis. If you look on the page of Budapest conference, you'll find a session about Windows backup there with a detailed description how to set up daily backup using an external US HDD.

On top of it all, from what I hear, TM's USED TO BE EDITABLE, but are not so anymore. In later versions of Trados this seems to have been changed. Where the **** is the improvement in that? What's the point of not-asked-for gimmicks like Synergy if the basic functions of Trados aren't working reliably?

TMs were never ediatble in external editor. They were and are editable in Workbench, using the maintenance function. To be able to edit TM in external editor, you need to export it as text.

If this problem turns out to be unsolvable and my TM will be lost I am in a good mood to sue SDL. The marketing promises do not hold true, I feel a victim of fraudulent misrepresentation. Please let me know if you feel similarly or if I am being unreasonable.

Well, I'm sorry but I feel I need to pull you back down to the earth. Software is and never was to be considered completly secure. Neither is Trados.

Now I shall try to provide you some usefull help.
You said, you damaged the TM by importing a small, aligned one.
If you left the "ALIGN!" as the user ID for the segments, created during the alignment, you may now be able to search the TM with the maintenance function using this ID and delete all units there. Another option would be filtering the search in the maintenance by date and removing everything added after a certain date (of course the date you imported this unfotrunate alignment).

Just another option would be using a file recovery software, allowing you to show deleted files on your HDD - you might have luck and be able to restore something with this method.

And please take my advice for the future. An external HDD with 500 GB storage capacity will cost you 99 Euro as per today (a lot of offers available for that price) and additionaly approx. 10 Euro for a timer. After you have set up a daily backup. With daily backup and worst-case scenario you lose only last 24 hours of your work. Of course there is another horror worst-case scenario, when both your main PC and the external HDD say good night, but the probability is really not that big.

Jerzy

[Edited at 2007-08-12 21:57]


 
Marinus Vesseur
Marinus Vesseur  Identity Verified
Canada
Local time: 08:58
English to Dutch
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
What Backup solution for non-geeks do you recommend? Aug 14, 2007

Thanks to all for your comments and suggestions. Of course, with a good backup solution all this trouble wouldn't have happened.

I have a feeling that at least more than half of my colleagues (the non-geeks) do not have a proper backup solution, so what would be your suggestion for 'dummies'? I've got all the hardware, but what program would write specific files away to an external drive continually, incrementally and automatically? Something simple, but effective, that works witho
... See more
Thanks to all for your comments and suggestions. Of course, with a good backup solution all this trouble wouldn't have happened.

I have a feeling that at least more than half of my colleagues (the non-geeks) do not have a proper backup solution, so what would be your suggestion for 'dummies'? I've got all the hardware, but what program would write specific files away to an external drive continually, incrementally and automatically? Something simple, but effective, that works without me having to push any buttons or make decisions about formats, markers, etc.

In short: non-geek, for normal people.

Would appreciate your suggestions.
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Jerzy Czopik
Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 16:58
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
No special program necessary, only some hardware Aug 15, 2007

First of all: Backup is VERY important, and not that complicated as you mean.
You need:

  • An external hard drive with similar capacity to your main HDD
  • A timer

All togehter for about 110 Euros today.

Connect your external HDD to your PC via USB. Do all necessary setup, so that your PC recognises the drive. Note, what drive letter has been assigned to your external
... See more
First of all: Backup is VERY important, and not that complicated as you mean.
You need:

  • An external hard drive with similar capacity to your main HDD
  • A timer

All togehter for about 110 Euros today.

Connect your external HDD to your PC via USB. Do all necessary setup, so that your PC recognises the drive. Note, what drive letter has been assigned to your external USB harrdrive. Format the USB HDD. Create following folder on your USB HDD:

  • 01_Monday
  • 02_Tuesday
  • 03_Wednesday
  • 04_Thursday
  • 05_Friday
  • 06_Saturday
  • 07_Sunday

The numbers are only for sorting the list, you may also not use them. It is just an example.
You may also wish to create a "System" folder just for backing up your whole Windows installation, but this is not really necessary.
Now your external HDD has been prepared.
Download this self-extracting archive. Extract the ppt from it. The ppt contains a detailed description how to setup the Windows backup utility to backup your data on regular basis.
Chose a time every day, when your PC may run, but you will certainly not work or at least when the PC may be a bit slower, when you work. The best option would be dinner time or so, so that you could leave your PC for half an hour or so and let it do the backup undisturbed. This is for 6 days in a week. Then chose one single day in a week, when you certainly won't work - for example Friday evening or Sunday morning. Bear in mind, that you can only produce backup, when your PC is on and running, so chose better a time after you usually finish your work instead of a time before you start, as you will certainly forget to turn your PC on. It is easier to keep in mind to leave it on as to remember to switch it on.
The backup strartegy is as follows:

  • full backup once a week
  • differenatial backup on every other weekday

For example:

  • full backup on Firday at 8 pm
  • differential backup on Monday-Thursday and Saturday-Sunday at 8 pm

To get your data restored you will then need the last full backup and the last differential backup. This is the easiest backup strategy I can think of, but it works like a charm. Of course such a solution is not suitable for big companies, when they need to be able to restore any particular day in defined past. This way you will only secure the last stand of your data - but this is enough for freelancer.
Place the full backup in the folder 05_Friday on your USB HDD and name it "Full Backup Friday". Place all other backups in other folders, naming them accordingly (ie "Backup Tuesday" in folder "02_Tuesday").
Now let the first full backup run and measure, how long does it take. This may be even two or three hours. Calculate additional half an hour to what you measured.
Then take the timer and create a weekly program. For Monday-Thursday and Saturday-Sunday program starting time at 8 pm and end time at 9 pm. For Friday program starting time at 8 pm and end time accordingly to what you measured (ie 11:30 pm, if you measured 3 hours).
To be very sophisticated you could also program an extra part for dismounting the USB HDD from Windows, but even without this solution will work.

I'm using such backup solution since over 2 years now and am happy with it.
Jerzy

PS
This is a solution for anyone, who does not want to press any buttons and so on. Only what you must think of, is letting your PC on at times, when backup shall be written. Nothing more. All other actions will be taken fully automatically.



[Edited at 2007-08-15 00:07]
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Marinus Vesseur
Marinus Vesseur  Identity Verified
Canada
Local time: 08:58
English to Dutch
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Trados 2007 SP2 and Multiterm 2007 SP1 now working okay Feb 6, 2008

Just a small addendum to my ranting and raving about the Trados 2007 bugs: after installing SP2 all is now well. It seems SDL has taken some of the complaints to heart and has eradicated the worst bugs. Same applies to MultiTerm 2007 SP1.

Mind you, I'm still working with Windows XP and MS Office 2003, so I don't know how it is with the compatibility with Vista and Office 2007.

By the way: have you looked into the 'ideas' website yet? Not a bad concept, let's hope it re
... See more
Just a small addendum to my ranting and raving about the Trados 2007 bugs: after installing SP2 all is now well. It seems SDL has taken some of the complaints to heart and has eradicated the worst bugs. Same applies to MultiTerm 2007 SP1.

Mind you, I'm still working with Windows XP and MS Office 2003, so I don't know how it is with the compatibility with Vista and Office 2007.

By the way: have you looked into the 'ideas' website yet? Not a bad concept, let's hope it really leads to some improvements: http://ideas.sdltrados.com/default.asp

I still think Trados is the most unintuitive program suite ever, but at least it seems to be reliable again and some real improvement are being implemented. Daily backups are still a good idea, though. (Good, free online backup solution: www.idrive.com)
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Marinus Vesseur
Marinus Vesseur  Identity Verified
Canada
Local time: 08:58
English to Dutch
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
It happened again: Trados database irrepairably corrupted Aug 16, 2008

Sorry to be such a messenger of bad news when it comes to SDL Trados, but I'm not making this up: a small TM of mine was irrepairably corrupted again. I switch between languages and TM's a lot, maybe I'm more prone to trouble that way.

Anyway, high time for a full backup again.


 
Grzegorz Gryc
Grzegorz Gryc  Identity Verified
Local time: 16:58
French to Polish
+ ...
Backup software... Aug 16, 2008

Jerzy Czopik wrote:

First of all: Backup is VERY important, and not that complicated as you mean.
You need:

  • An external hard drive with similar capacity to your main HDD
  • A timer

All togehter for about 110 Euros today.


[/quote]

Seconded.

Another (complementary) approach is to buy Acronis and create disk images.
The Acronis Home version costs approx. 50 USD.
The differential backups are possible too if you want to save some space.
You can schedule backups in the way you like.
It's really easy.

The advantage of Acronis is you can extremely rapidly restore the state of the entire PC, sector by sector and revert to a checked, working Trados installation.
E.g. in a regular basis, I have problems to make work together Trados and Multiterm in a very complex type of installation dedicated to .Net localization.
If something goes wrong, I have a working PC in a half of hour instead of 2-3 days.

PS.
Do you have an UPS?
Trados TMs may be extremely vulnerable when the power is switched off during some operations.

Cheers
GG


 
Emma Gledhill
Emma Gledhill
Switzerland
Local time: 16:58
German to English
+ ...
Fails even with a backup Aug 13, 2009

Had this happen to me a couple of years ago with a lesser-used TM, then again this morning with a biggie. Unless I can come up with a clever idea I'm back down to about 320K units from 470K plus I can't remember exactly what happened a couple of years ago, but this morning's was after importing a supplied TM.

I have to say even keeping backups doesn't help. My machine is backed up permanently using Time Machine so I
... See more
Had this happen to me a couple of years ago with a lesser-used TM, then again this morning with a biggie. Unless I can come up with a clever idea I'm back down to about 320K units from 470K plus I can't remember exactly what happened a couple of years ago, but this morning's was after importing a supplied TM.

I have to say even keeping backups doesn't help. My machine is backed up permanently using Time Machine so I restored the TM version from the middle of the night (i.e. before the import but totally up-to-date) and then exporting that but still get the same error on what should have been a clean version.

I had already started running exports before any import on another TM that I'd been having problems with (also heading towards half a million units, also after import of a supplied TM - coincidence?) but had thought it an isolated problem. Evidently not, so I will henceforth export before any import as a matter of course.

On a related note, the TM I'd been having problems with recently I was able to export fine, but if I imported it into a new TM and then the supplied txt file, it crashed again. If I imported the supplied export file into a new TM and then my own export, all works fine.

[Edited at 2009-08-13 14:21 GMT]
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Alasdair Graham-Brown
Alasdair Graham-Brown  Identity Verified
Norway
Local time: 16:58
Swedish to English
+ ...
Olaf is a genius Sep 22, 2009

Olaf is a genius. His tip of creating a new TM in a new directory and copying in the Tm database only works. It is clearly the index files that get corrupted - and they recreate.

 
Claudio Porcellana (X)
Claudio Porcellana (X)  Identity Verified
Italy
similar issue Sep 22, 2009

I have the same issue since a week or so starting with a **certain project**

suddendly, from one day to the next, the Concordance stopped to work, the Reorganize tool freezes on Loading and I can't clean work files in **this project** (even currently)

I've tried **all workarounds** and the problems remain

I have SDL Trados 2007 SP2 and SOME project memories work well, while other doesn't

I had 3 suspects:
1 - some OS/Office uppdate, but
... See more
I have the same issue since a week or so starting with a **certain project**

suddendly, from one day to the next, the Concordance stopped to work, the Reorganize tool freezes on Loading and I can't clean work files in **this project** (even currently)

I've tried **all workarounds** and the problems remain

I have SDL Trados 2007 SP2 and SOME project memories work well, while other doesn't

I had 3 suspects:
1 - some OS/Office uppdate, but I have Acronis, and even the restore failed

2 - ISO issues
for example {nosupersub m}{super 2}
I see many of these braces in my fault memory (and Marinus's too) and Trados use the same braces as internal tags ...
simply a coincidence?

the problem is that these tags are used even for legal reasons, for example to built subscripts, bolds and so on, and anyway, to remove all braces from a 20 000 TUs memory would be an incubus

3 - sniper tags (OCRs, and so on), but the issue applies even to some old memories that worked without any problem before

Claudio

[Modificato alle 2009-09-22 20:51 GMT]
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Corvex
Corvex
Local time: 16:58
German to Hungarian
can't delete Apr 17, 2010

I would glad, if I only knew the method of deleting the corrupt entry: because I know exactly, which entry is it, and I can find it even by concordance-search. However, by the try to delete it I see an error-message: "(32004): Matrix Error: Required column entry not found, data file (...)tmw: Delete". If someone could suggest me a solution to that special part of the problem? (The one with creating a new tm and copying the old tmw did not work.)

 
Claudio Porcellana (X)
Claudio Porcellana (X)  Identity Verified
Italy
can't delete Apr 17, 2010

sure that you can delete it!
export your memory in .txt, use the Search option and manually delete it

Claudio

Corvex wrote:

I would glad, if I only knew the method of deleting the corrupt entry: because I know exactly, which entry is it, and I can find it even by concordance-search. However, by the try to delete it I see an error-message: "(32004): Matrix Error: Required column entry not found, data file (...)tmw: Delete". If someone could suggest me a solution to that special part of the problem? (The one with creating a new tm and copying the old tmw did not work.)


[Modificato alle 2010-04-17 19:25 GMT]


 
Vito Smolej
Vito Smolej
Germany
Local time: 16:58
Member (2004)
English to Slovenian
+ ...
SITE LOCALIZER
er... Apr 17, 2010

Claudio Porcellana wrote:

sure that you can delete it!
export your memory in .txt, use the Search option and manually delete it



...assuming of course, that you can still export it...

PS: Marinus, how`s your TM doing? Still have problems with it (g)?

[Edited at 2010-04-17 19:39 GMT]


 
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SDL Trados 8 (2007) cannot reorganise TM, database corrupted, Workbench gets stuck while exporting.







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